Hello; so for my first trick I give you a writing styles discussion... This is more of an informal panel where everyone can talk about what writing styles and methods they use; what issues they are having with them and get advice on how to make for better writing. So my first question for people to stimulate this discussion is... What styles of writing do you use in your group; do you differ from other players/GMs in your particular RP/Sim.... and finally does this mesh well with everyone in your group?
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:04 PM
So I guess it depends on what you mean by style exactly.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:06 PM
Thats true; I guess the term could be interpreted differently so then; as a group lets define what that actually means as writing style could mean all sorts of things from the tone of your writing to the perspective (first, second third) and if your method is omniscient or not which from my experience most role plays write in third person omniscient but who knows someone may do it differently. (edited)
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:08 PM
Our club as a a whole writes in 3rd person, past -tense. So all RP begins with that format.
Beautiful Night18-Apr-20 02:08 PM
In my experiences, which is admittedly limited to trek sims, its largely been 3rd person limited, i.e. from the perspective of the PC/NPC
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:08 PM
So, in this case: I've foundfor the group I write in, the use third person limited past tense.
Beautiful Night18-Apr-20 02:08 PM
And omniscient is reserved for the Story Runner to impart information and things to react to
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:08 PM
yeah, same for us.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:08 PM
I'm probably fairly unique in that my style incorporates Weber-isms, that is, I can't resist adding world building segments to flesh out my thoughts and add in neat things
(and I call it Weber isms, because in the middle of a combat battle, a talk about international war standards is probably not deserved)
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:09 PM
Thats true; players would hav eto write in limited as the game managers or hosts/COs would really be the ones who define the plot depending on how you rurn your game
so omniscient would be hard for players to write (edited)
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:09 PM
but 118 is fairly unique in that it operats where everyone creates the canon and overruling of it is frowned on
SilverNight18-Apr-20 02:09 PM
Can we post examples?
I'd say a mix of descriptive 3rd and some random information bits.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:09 PM
WHen I write for SA, or 22nd fleet, I constrain my writing a bit
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:10 PM
I would say description etc is a stylist choice though, rather than a set expectation everyone writes from.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:10 PM
Yeah; lots post examples and see how each group writes... This whole panel is really for all of us to improve our style, get advice and see where it takes us; I had no set structure for this panel
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:10 PM
because, yeah, I can probably explain better with examples, sadly
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:11 PM
I prefer 3rd person since it reads better between single posts as a cohesive story.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:11 PM
So.. for example, this is my typical writing style:
Malconvoke: Sera Chatva. ::Due to some bits of his heritage, his s's were far more sibilant and serpentine, silkily spilling forth in a stream:: Can we confirm if this is due to ECM, or is there possibly something wrong with our gravitational sensors?
His colony, Avalon, had deliberately tried to add back some of the more archaic forms of address, adding their own twist, and he found he used them often. It wasn't his fault that most humans didn't recognize the proper forms of address for nobility. Or that they were themselves more noble than they'd admit. But that was neither here nor there.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:12 PM
So I guess another thing about style to bring up is some gorups use certain tags and formatting for comms and thoughts but others do not.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:12 PM
It's modified script, but you can see where I interject world building and.. kind of a style where you can't directly tell if it's actual information or the character's opnion
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:12 PM
So since its different from group to group... that makes it hard for newer writers to mesh with a style
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:12 PM
Mortar rounds tore the air in a thunderous roar as fiery death descended upon us. I clutched my rifle to my chest, shivering half with cold and half from fear. My hands were numb, I had lost track of the countless hours suffering in the frigid rain. Nothing kept out the chill. They would be raining gunfire upon us soon. I had to shoot. I squinted through the crimson haze of smoke and burning corpses, trying to ignore the taste of ash and blood in my mouth. Just one good shot, that’s all I needed.
I only use 1st person for journals.
Or in that case, it's an in-character journal. (edited)
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:14 PM
118 has an academy for that yeah,
A week full of tutorials and training officers to acclimatize you to the fleet
(also to teach by example how the fleet operates)
Zech ♿18-Apr-20 02:15 PM
It works very well
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:15 PM
I've only ever used first person in logs and briefings. Outside of that; third person. (edited)
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:16 PM
We've an Academy too. plus a Player Handbook (that is being updated)
it helps people get used to RPing in our very specific setting
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:17 PM
Oh Academy; yeah... that is good for new players... Get them used to your play-style.
SilverNight18-Apr-20 02:17 PM
this is a clipped version.. this took two posts for two different people.
The security team in the room seemed more interested in watching Galoh as much as he was in them as they occassionally glanced at their own version of the PADD and answered small pings from the monitors around them, dealing with the short end of things needing signed off on, "That over-engineering seems to be a rather nice asset to have when a species has the time to accomplish it. It also makes it easier in the sense of compatibility with non-standard systems, It wasn't too hard to take the designs we had access to thanks to the Romulans, and Ferengi traders. The last of which were mildly amusing before we dealt with them and liquidated their assets when they were caught stealing." He'd take a sip of his own drink and put his feet up, "Their theft has made us rather leery of any further incursions from their people. They don't make it to our borders, when they do? they tend to be politely asked to leave. Often after all scans and their computers have been cleaned of any evidence we exist. Those that don't like it, don't make it very far before the rest of the expanse has it's say about it. A few of the other species we're allied with out here are not fond of interlopers. We deal with the Romulans along our borders and trade with a few other species further into the expanse, it's helped that the Romulans and the Klingons have a very poor reputation here while your federation is viewed as amusing and naïve, like children just learning how to walk. This is our quiet sector of the map and we like it that way." He paused and gave Galoh a level stare, "And it is going to stay very quiet, yes?"
(not posting second part as its in the same vein as the above)
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:19 PM
Then there is the argument between active voice and passive voice.
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:20 PM
Do you think that that is a stylistic experience thing? (edited)
Ie. more experienced writers can recognize and actively choose that?
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:20 PM
All of this brings up another thing; different players writing in different voice...
SilverNight18-Apr-20 02:20 PM
Oh god, juggling multiple different styles of characters/voices/settings can be a handful, but feels so rewarding if you pull it off well.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:21 PM
It is a style/experience deal. I have a nice quote from the Onyx Path Publishing style guide.
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 02:21 PM
Playing a paranoid character is fun.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:21 PM
I.. wish I was able to av oid passive voice
But I hvae problems recognizing it unless I look for it hard.
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 02:22 PM
Especially when every other character knows they're paranoid and things get weird quick.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:23 PM
The Second Commandment: Thou shalt use active voice. ("He killed the Exalt," not "The Exalt was killed by him.") Active voice rules. Active voice excites, titillates and arouses. Active voice grips the reader. Active voice is alternative. It's cutting-edge. It wears flannel and bondage gear at the same time. It has more tattoos than the Hell's Angels and the Yakuza combined. Use it.
Word’s grammar checking feature can be set to flag passive voice.
The Third Commandment: Thou shalt write in the present tense as much as possible. Rather than write "If none of the characters can, Dave will break down the door," write "If none of the characters can, Dave breaks down the door." The former implies delayed action and distances the reader from events. The latter implies immediate action and involves the reader in the event being described. The first writing style is reactive, the second is active. Also, do not change tenses or persons in the middle of a paragraph or section, and try to be as consistent as possible.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:23 PM
.. that's actually useful
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:24 PM
This is a specific style guide for a TTRPG Publisher's Submissions.
Margaret Atwood’s Masterclass’s description of 3rd person frames it best: Robust character development. Third person has a wider narrative scope than its first and second-person counterparts, and can shine the spotlight on more than one character. These multiple angles give a reader a 360-degree view of the plot, each adding information that another character doesn’t have, creating a rich, complex narrative. Narrative flexibility. Third person can offer more flexibility—you can be everywhere, help your reader see everything, and switch between various characters’ stories. You can go from complete omniscience to a limited or close third point of view. This latter style gives you the ability to be inside a character’s thoughts, feelings, and sensations, which can give readers a deeper experience of character and scene.2)
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:25 PM
THat makes esnse
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:25 PM
It is a style preference that varies on genre. (edited)
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:26 PM
Are thee any community resources that are not group specific that people know of; I know there used to be more but from my knowledge they are gone.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:26 PM
Typically, in normal publishing YA and romance fiction is First person, active narration.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:26 PM
I think, one of the strenghts of third person writing is this:
It was times like this when she wondered if this was meant to be a confusing malestrom of actvity rather than determining a purpose and acting on it. They had.. another 35 hours, unless the crew was in danger, which, admittedly, they didn't know. An untested, and frankly, risky, transporter method? No attempts to cut through the ECM? This seemed an awful quick time to put all of their eggs in one basket.
Granted, it wasn't her call. The best she could do is give her advice. After all, he was only the CO due to everyone senior to him not being on the bridge, and he was probably nervous. No point in being overly critical, right?
.oO I'm not sure I could do better.. Oo
You can .. reflect more internal thought and opinions by exposing them
Without having to rephrase them into a first person narrative
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:27 PM
Third person voicing can be used to say what multiple people are thinking and other events happening elsewhere. that is what I like
Immortal Cyan18-Apr-20 02:29 PM
I'm trying to get better at conveying internal thought and opinions in third person but at times it can feel awkward and like I'm shifting my tone too much.
Although I guess that's what you're supposed to do with third person.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:29 PM
yeah.. I'm.. not good at it, I feel?
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:29 PM
3rd person omnipresent allows that.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:29 PM
I've had people tell me it's hard to tell where my thoughts end, and narration begins
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:30 PM
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:30 PM
*my character thoughts
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:30 PM
Decay had ravaged the warehouse door. Time faded and peeled back its paint to expose base metal, corroding and leaving it jagged with rust. Moisture beaded along the handle and against the smooth paint of the lock. Why was only the lock replaced? Mari wondered.
Her gaze moved toward shapes clustered in the shadows, indistinguishable from the doorway. She squinted before looking towards the walls on either side of the door, and found the light switch to the right. She flipped the toggle up. Overhead, a weak flicker of light responded for a moment before it fizzled back to objecting darkness. Mari grumbled.
She squinted as she turned back towards the open warehouse, searching for a familiar shape in the shadows. “Adam?” Her voice echoed.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:31 PM
mmm. I always appreciate that kind of writing
It's got actual details
and paitns a picture
using the internal thoughts to do so
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:32 PM
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:32 PM
Thank you. These examples are from my WIP novella but I try to write my posts like I am writing a novel since we are collaborating on a story.
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:33 PM
I personally had an interesting transition when I first started RPing because I had been working in a corporate office and had lost a lot of my creative writing skills. It took awhile to stop being so crisp and short and evolve my tone and style
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:33 PM
I have that problem. My background is technical support and my writing classes were techincal writing
so.. I prefer to be laconic
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:33 PM
Now I'm writing novels, so I'm more aware of how I write.
Beautiful Night18-Apr-20 02:33 PM
i'd argue that being crisp isn't a bad thing
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:33 PM
(Kim: If that's an example of the novella, I look foward to it.)
It's not but..
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:33 PM
crips has it's place, when used right
Beautiful Night18-Apr-20 02:34 PM
there's a differencen between writing enough, and getting florid for the sake of length
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:34 PM
It is. @Kylindra
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:34 PM
.. yeah, I know that. I've seem some sims that could have been cut in half
and I've tried to find a style that helps me there. =/
Beautiful Night18-Apr-20 02:36 PM
If I have a syle guide, its the bastard offspring of anything written by Terry Pratchett and Jim Butcher, lovlingly raised by Strunk & white's Elements of Style
Rule 17, especially. Omit needless words
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:37 PM
I can only speak for our particular set-up, but I find since it's more immediate of a story evolving, I'm much more forgiving with my writing style in a smaller post, then say a larger background piece I'm writing.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:38 PM
So what do people have questions about from here since we have 20 minutes
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:38 PM
A good JP flows between writers so you can't tell the difference in who's writing.
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:39 PM
we don't write in JPs
we're a bulletin board set-up
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:40 PM
We do as well. As the GM I will go back and edit posts for tense and spelling.
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:40 PM
so you can interject bits and pieces, but you're building the story one post after another. It means everyone's styles just comingle
generally, I would say that good threads that are really awesome to read usually have players with similar skill levels
and they tend to encourage those with less writing experience to expand
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:41 PM
RP can help people improve.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:42 PM
Yeah. I've gotten better at writing by constant practice via RP
(In the case of 118, most sims are singletary, but JPs are somewhat frequent during non-mission time.)
and I find that it does help a lot to sharpen some skills
SilverNight18-Apr-20 02:44 PM
I do enjoy a good joint post that blends both writers styles, it's hard to get them consistently though.
River18-Apr-20 02:46 PM
What I've noticed is people tend to write at the level of the majority around them
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:47 PM
to get people to write in a particular group format
Rockyeahh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:47 PM
Yes getting a group together regularly to write can be a headache...
But it's wonderful when it all comes together and everybody feels like they've done something cool with their character while inreracting with the others. :)
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:49 PM
What I do know as a CO of a specific ship within our larger club is that it takes time to cultivate a group that really gels.
And lots of patience
It becomes wonderfully collaborative at that point
Rockyeahh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:51 PM
Yea when get a good mix of people/characters get going at once, things just flow out. Which i can imagine is the case with a good televison writing team or any group of creatives. (edited)
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:52 PM
There's a lot of be said for having a similar creative vision that can flex and adapt to things as you go along
Blitzen18-Apr-20 02:56 PM
The problem I have with that (and I'm sorry if this isn't the place to add it) is keeping everyone going in a similar direction. If I outline too much, I'm making the story too linear. If I don't outline, sometimes the story gets halted when too many people want to go in different directions.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:57 PM
This panel ends in 4 minutes.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:57 PM
Anyone have anything else to say before we end?
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:57 PM
Ahhh, the crux of the GM.
I always favour gentle individual nudges is we're really getting out of hand.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:58 PM
Next panel in here is Chat on Fantasy with @Archie Skystriker and @Azalea
Kylindra18-Apr-20 02:58 PM
yeah, that's always a dillema when people add a twist that completely derails the story
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 02:59 PM
BusyBeaver18-Apr-20 02:59 PM
Thanks for the chat folks. Was really nice.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 02:59 PM
If people wish to continue, we can move the style discussion to Overflow
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 02:59 PM
Jolteon & Messenger its now your room. Does anyone want to move our session to an overflow or we done?
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:00 PM
Thank you @Josh [TNU]
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 03:00 PM
No problem Alrighty cool ENjoy.
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:00 PM
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:01 PM
Ready as you are
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:01 PM
So in otherwords not at all
lol lets start
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:01 PM
No I am ready, just that we are both nervous
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:02 PM
Hey everyone, Sparky and I are from https://roleplay.fandom.com you might remember us from last year's game show The Simming Endeavor, when we were contestants! For the past year, we’ve been wanting to do a panel for Sciworld. This year we finally got the courage to do it, thanks for letting us be here today and I hope you enjoy what we’ve cooked up! Feel free to ask questions at any time.
Today we will be talking about the fantasy genre in roleplaying. The fantasy genre is, in itself, a blank canvas. The people in a fantasy roleplay can really let their imaginations run wild with the amount of creatures and number of unique stories.
Although many roleplays in the fantasy genre have magic or supernatural elements, they are not really necessary. You can have a great roleplay without them if you have the right components.
There are also many subgenres that fantasy has, making it one of the most diverse areas to roleplay. The subgenres range from Historical Fantasy, which takes its roots from events in the real world, to high fantasy, which is purely imaginary with little to no real life elements.
Immortal Cyan18-Apr-20 03:06 PM
I love high fantasy. Honestly, the higher the better for me, as a matter of preference. (edited)
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:07 PM
Oh, so you prefer to have the high imaginary portion of the spectrum
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:08 PM
Same, but sometimes it can be difficult knowing where to start,
Here are a few tips we've worked on to make a successful fantasy adventure:
First, having a good starting plot before the main adventure really does wonders in that it provides the roleplay with background and clears up the confusion. You don’t want your members to be asking themselves why they are in the story or getting so lost they end up leaving.
Once you get to the actual story it's time for the background information, do not be afraid to use your imagination. The more interesting the plot is, the more roleplayers will want to continue contributing.
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:11 PM
And that is mostly the plot and background, now, does anyone have questions before I get to the character portion
Kylindra18-Apr-20 03:12 PM
sounds good so far
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:12 PM
alright, then here we go
Just as adventures have the hero of the story, you can also make the story more interesting with a good villain. It gives the roleplay more depth if the hero/heroines have to struggle or have a conflict to surpass. A story without conflict or struggle gets boring quickly. You want to make sure that all of the roleplayers remain interested in it.
Although you are allowed to have as much imagination and detail as you can, be careful not to add too many things. Doing so may throw off the plot, in which case the roleplay could turn sour and be ruined.
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:15 PM
Alright so being apart of roleplay wiki and the other communities often I hear people ask how they can make a background for their character, because they feel their ideas can’t fit or aren’t good enough. The great thing about fantasy roleplays is that it’s designed to adapt, it’s all about imagination.
When you start to read the lore/plot and you start getting ideas, you need to write them down, even if you think they won’t fit because they will, and any idea is good enough. Sure, sometimes it needs to be worked on, but that’s how you learn. You need to be confident about your roleplaying in order to grow - not as just a roleplayer, but as a writer. Behind every great writer is a critic that made them try harder.
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:17 PM
Anyways, once you have made a base of your character and written the background as best as you can, written like this for example:
You need to start to fill in the details so that you feel more confident about your character. The more detail a character has, the more you and others can understand them and that makes the roleplay run smoother.
Are there any questions so far before I switch off to my partner for the next part
Blitzen18-Apr-20 03:20 PM
I'm good. You explained it great! XD
Kylindra18-Apr-20 03:20 PM
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:21 PM
Alright, well with that out of the way, @Azalea will you do the character tips, please
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:22 PM
Tips on creating a good character:
The one mistake new roleplayers or people who haven’t really been exposed to different styles of roleplaying make is making their character too cliche or too overpowered. Flaws give the character a sense of normality and can resonate with the person playing the character.
If a character is too overpowered it gives the roleplay a bad vibe and causes it to end quickly without being completed.
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:24 PM
The keys to a good character is:
Only give your character 2-3 needed abilities, but avoid making it where he or she is so powerful they can’t be defended if a fight between characters does happen at one point. While they can be skilled and strong even the best can lose you need to keep it realistic the best you can.
Blitzen18-Apr-20 03:27 PM
One of the things I've started doing lately (suggested by a friend) is listing out or having my players list out 3 things they can do, and 10 they can't. The problem I'm finding as a mod is that no one ever thinks they're overpowering.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 03:27 PM
the thing is, what do you do when the general drift of the character is that they aren't bad at anything, but they aren't really good at anyhting much either?
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:28 PM
So you mean a jack of all trades character
Kylindra18-Apr-20 03:28 PM
more or less
(Or someone who wants to develop their strength in the roleplay, in any case.)
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:29 PM
I am unsure, I believe the best course of action would to pick something that they want to get better at the most and work with that
does that answer your question @Kylindra
Kylindra18-Apr-20 03:30 PM
Meme God18-Apr-20 03:31 PM
hmm okay can u define needed ablilites for me? to me that can mean pretty much anything. so do u mean like needed as in what rp ur in when u make the character? im a tad confused on that so i hope this makes sense
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:32 PM
Depending on the roleplay a character might need certain abilities to survive but sometimes roleplayers list every ability which is too much
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:33 PM
Well, you should only give them one or two abilities, but make sure they are basic abilities. Like if I wanted to give my character fire, it should only be a small flame and not one to wipe out a forest
Meme God18-Apr-20 03:33 PM
sp try and scale it to what u need?
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:33 PM
I'm going to reference The Demon Light's roleplay here
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:34 PM
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:35 PM
My character Melissa has very few abilities like healing but its limited because of the type of roleplay it is and her type of personality healing made sense for her because she has at times looked out for her comrades, but its simple not too powerful but useful for her cause
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:35 PM
you know that was the example I thought you were going to use lol
Meme God18-Apr-20 03:36 PM
hmm so try and keep it scaled for what u need it to do? so it doesn't get too overpowered
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:36 PM
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:37 PM
and of course I would use Melissa
Meme God18-Apr-20 03:38 PM
alright thank you that was really helpful for me
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:38 PM
She's my best character
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:38 PM
And mine would be Alistar, he is the one I use frequently
A Lot of roleplayers try to create that cool edgy character that stands out from the crowd like in a lot of the stories, tv shows, and movies we are exposed to, there's always that misunderstood mistreated hero like: Harry Potter, Percy Jackson or Eragon (from the inheritance cycle), Or even the villain that turns good like: Draco Malfoy, Luke Castellan, or Murtagh. What you need is to forget trying to make your character stand out and just make your special by writing it where it connects to a part of who you are
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:39 PM
You stole my line lol
Meme God18-Apr-20 03:40 PM
so make it as if ur in the rp so its more realistic?
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:40 PM
Hmm, seems our lines got switched
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:40 PM
not exactly you to avoid making it a self insert but yes
more like stolen
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:41 PM
Oh, whatever, we will work with this XD
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:41 PM
Alrighty then lol
Meme God18-Apr-20 03:41 PM
oh okay i tend to put myself in the rp so do u guys have any tips on something i could to do tone thatdown? or is that something i have to rember not to go all in on
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:41 PM
When roleplaying, always express in detail how your character reacts not just with speech but with their expressions and their posture. Making a good character is easy when you follow a set of key guidelines like above. It gives your character a chance to grow as the story continues.
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:43 PM
Well, instead of throwing yourself in, maybe you should try and make it so the others know where you are coming from. That way you don't just appear in midair
that could in itself cause confusion
Meme God18-Apr-20 03:43 PM
yeah that is true alright
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:44 PM
In some roleplays, the setting can be just as important as the story itself. It provides the area in which different parts of the story take place, so it is important to make sure that the setting fits the story.
You must also think of what elements belong to your chosen setting. For example, if the hero is in the middle of the forest, it would make no sense for there to suddenly be an active volcano. Just as you do not want the plot to become a mess, you should avoid random elements in your chosen setting.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 03:45 PM
15 minutes. Let us know if you need to user overflow.
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:45 PM
@Azalea your turn
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:50 PM
Time also is a big part of the setting. If you skip around with the time too much, the roleplay becomes hard to keep track of. To keep it simple, try not to mess around with the time setting at all.
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:50 PM
Fantasy roleplays are normally always linked to other genres such as adventure, horror, and drama. Sometimes users might be confused on how to fit into its sister genre, but you shouldn’t worry about it, as long as you have your character built to where it’s flexible you can fix into any genre.
Some people think that Fantasy is a mess to keep track of. With so many elements and characteristics, how can the players hope to keep it organized? Well, keeping track of it is not that hard. You honestly do not have to stress yourself over the minor details. As with all great role plays and stories, fantasy uses a theme to try to remain organized. If you pick a theme to and surround the plot around that, then the organization is simple
Are there any questions before we get to our final topic?
Kylindra18-Apr-20 03:52 PM
no, it makes sense so far
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:53 PM
Elements of Fantasy:
There are many different elements that you can use to give your roleplay a splash of fantasy. Some of the more common of them are the use of magic, otherworldly creatures, fantasy races, and places and items that have abilities that seem strange.
Use of magic: There may be a time in your roleplay in which the characters or someone they meet has to use a certain spell to help the heroes/heroines advance in the story.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 03:55 PM
5 minutes until the next panel. Will you guys need an overflow?
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:55 PM
We should be fine, but we will let you know
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 03:55 PM
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:57 PM
Mythical Creatures: Some fantasies get the fantasy element by having creatures of legend or folklore appear. Some of these creatures include Dragons, Angels, Demons, and Fairies.
Places and Events: The setting can also give your roleplay a fantasy feel. Especially if it is a place of great magic. You can set your characters in an enchanted forest, fairy kingdom, or perhaps the destination is where the fantasy comes in, like a quest to discover a lost city.
Items: Perhaps there are not any magic users in the roleplay that you are doing, but you can still have items with magical properties. An enchanted sword, ring, or potion can also give your roleplay a more fantastical flare.
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:58 PM
That is all we have for our fantasy block. Does anyone have any questions
Azalea18-Apr-20 03:58 PM
This has been really fun and nerve wrecking
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 03:59 PM
Yeah I know, it was our first one, so it was expected
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 03:59 PM
Alrighty. Next panel will start shortly.
You guys did well
Archie Skystriker18-Apr-20 04:00 PM
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:00 PM
Good job guys! Next panel up is Trauma in Roleplaying hosted by me.
So this track primarily followed the Governors character, and played throughout his ventures. It has a really disturbing/dark tone which is perfect for those pivotal scenes.
Listen to how composer Bear Mccreary structured this piece: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBe-x7xlHAI...
Hello! Just to reintroduce myself. My name is Kim. I'm a member of the Horror Writers' Association and one of the administrators for Shattered Universe. I firmly place myself as a horror and comic book writer. I have been doing online roleplaying for over 20 years.
I find that new roleplayers and writers have issues depicting trauma. Or rather the impact of horrific events on players without falling into stereotypes.
Some people focus on the gory details of a scene or they forget to warn their players and make them uncomfortable or unhappy.
If you are a GM about to inflict a graphic scene on your players you need to level the expectations and gain their consent. You are trying to have fun BUT people need to be aware of what's going on or you cross a line.
Tackle Mature Content with Confidence! From fending off an attack by bloodthirsty pirates to delving into dank caverns, roleplaying games allow you to explore and experience things you probably don’t want to face in real life—or to approach topics from the perspective of chara...
Kylindra18-Apr-20 04:13 PM
This is the first I've heard of this story.. so time to read the link
Wes of StarArmy [SA]18-Apr-20 04:13 PM
When I was new at GMing I did a lot of stuff to try to make my RPs edgy and horrific that in retrospect were just weird and if I had a guide like this when I was a new GM it would have been a huge help instead of having to learn it the hard way. (edited)
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:14 PM
Many people play roleplay games to deal with personal trauma so if you don't consider people's backgrounds, you can do more harm than good.
Wes of StarArmy [SA]18-Apr-20 04:15 PM
In online conventions like Contessa a system where players can use some sort of "this makes me uncomfortable" flag a player can wave is the norm and a requirement.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:15 PM
The emotional impact of a scene can be more powerful than the gritty details of what happened. I think fading to black and letting a character react to it or work through it can be quite powerful.
When a person undergoes trauma, their memories can be fragmented. Things might be recalled out of sequence. They can have nightmares. Smells and sounds can trigger involuntary responses. Then how the other characters react can also be powerful
Marianne was dressed in an oversized Saints sweatshirt and new denim jeans. Her dull black hair was tied, unflatteringly in a messy ponytail. Her slender hands were in her lap, strangling a tissue while her full lips were drawn tight, her narrow shoulders slumped forward, and her honey brown eyes were focused on the floor. Moriko recognized the posture and the haunted expression on the woman’s face. Her attention shifted to the other side of the room, looking for Marianne’s husband, Alan.
Moriko saw Alan’s messy auburn spikes as he leaned back in his chair, blankly staring at a faded event poster on the wall. His green Notre Dame sweatshirt was two sizes too big for what appeared to be a lean frame. He had dark circles under his gray eyes. Like his wife, he was closed off from the rest of the group.
“Good job everyone, please take a 15-minute break,” Moriko called cheerfully. She watched people shuffle around the room. Alan and Marianne slowly stood and moved towards the back. Moriko’s fingers itched but she needed to know what was going on. The Fields hadn’t made any progress in the past month of therapy and had only became more withdrawn. “Marianne, Alan, could I talk to you for a minute?”
Marianne flinched before met her husband’s gaze. Alan slowly nodded before replying, “Sure, Doc.”
From that short segment, we can understand that something happened.
Usually, people that experience trauma can also feel a great deal of shame so they shy away from talking about it or they downplay what happened to make it more manageable.
RaWolfe18-Apr-20 04:21 PM
Can i ask a question?
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:21 PM
I see many characters that experience trauma launch into "hello, here is my tragic backstory".
RaWolfe18-Apr-20 04:22 PM
Where do you put the line, like how far is mabe to far when it comes to trauma. Maybe folks are sensitive for certain trauma's?
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:22 PM
Please feel free to comment or ask questions as we go. I am previously a Police/ 911 Dispatcher and a Sexual Assault Victim Advocate.
The line will vary by player. It might be easier to ask your players what they DON'T want to RP.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 04:23 PM
Consent discussion is totally a thing.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:23 PM
In Vampire the Masquerade 5th edition when we made our Chronicle Tenents we agreed that we were not cool with Animal abuse, violence of any sort towards children and roleplaying sexual trauma.
If you have a mixed group, make it the most restrictive just in case.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 04:24 PM
In some groups, they just agree to ban most traumatic topics or require pg-13 descriptions of it
RaWolfe18-Apr-20 04:24 PM
Makes sense, but what if some scene gets to...gore?
Wes of StarArmy [SA]18-Apr-20 04:24 PM
It's good to get your players together in advance and you can simply ask them at the outset what areas they aren't comfortable with, and either avoid that stuff or let the player sit out those parts without anything lost for skipping them.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:24 PM
That's an early content rating.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 04:24 PM
SilverNight18-Apr-20 04:25 PM
Gore/consent/Ground Rules is usually something that a good session 0 can flesh out (edited)
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 04:25 PM
I brought this up in VOIP, but I think a big part of it is setting expectations early and making sure everyone involved is aware of the etiquette and what the GM is willing to do. I think a lot of horror stories come from ground rules not being set.
SilverNight18-Apr-20 04:25 PM
*Can = Should
Kylindra18-Apr-20 04:25 PM
(118, incidentally, is one ofthem, flat out only allows PG-13 content.)
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:25 PM
I run 18+ games so the gore is pretty nuts.
Wes of StarArmy [SA]18-Apr-20 04:25 PM
Rip and tear!
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:25 PM
I try not to be too over the top. You should leave some gaps for people to fill in.
I will provide a gory example under a spoiler tag.
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 04:27 PM
I tend to run very fast paced games, so a lot of my rules are mostly about keeping play flowing and everyone involved. So no purple prose about how you squish the goblin to pieces.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:27 PM
This isn’t fucking funny. Her jaw ached from clenching it. Sweat pooled at the base of her back. As she picked her way through the box maze to the right as she was instructed. Her nose was assaulted by an overwhelming stench of bile and excrement. Mari gagged and turned her face into her shoulder.
Her gun and flashlight prevented her from covering her nose otherwise. Reflexively, she closed her eyes and counted to 10. She had learned that the easiest way to deal with many things she couldn’t avoid, like bad smells, was to just endure it until she could ignore it. When she opened her eyes again, she continued forward. Her narrow beam of light illuminated more boxes and reflected against something between them.
Mari narrowed her eyes as the object became clearer- it was Adam’s phone. Her wristband vibrated for an alert and she froze. A chill ran through her as she gulped.
“Ha! Look up!” The message scrolled.
Slowly, she raised her beam and the gun up to the ceiling. Her eyes went wide as her light revealed a familiar male figure naked and bound in chains. His legs were coated thickly with blood but pieces were missing from his calf, exposing bone. His genitals were an indistinguishable mash of flesh and blood. His torso was pried open with his back skin flayed open like fleshy wings. Rusted barb wire savagely bit into pale flesh at the wrists and neck. Raw gaping holes stared back where mischievous hazel eyes should have been. Sobbing, Mari fell to her knees. In the distance were the familiar wails of sirens joined by sadistic laughter. (edited)
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 04:27 PM
I try to do realistic gore
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:28 PM
Beyond a splintered dark wooden door, apartment 148 was stained a vivid shade of magenta. Violence and pain had seeped into each piece of furniture. Copper and bile assaulted Detective Hill’s nostrils, making his stomach heave in revulsion as he fought down his lunch. “What could have done this, Doc?”
“This much blood, Ethan? I wouldn’t be surprised if there were multiple blood types. It reminds me of an explosion.” Maeve kneeled down to examine the long bloody streaks that led from the doorway deeper into the apartment.(edited)
Both of those are still fairly light in gore, to be honest
Wes of StarArmy [SA]18-Apr-20 04:29 PM
I am reminded of the time we found that the Mishhuvurthyar were running sausage meat factories but they weren't for processing animals
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 04:30 PM
Keeping it at mystery meat rations for players to find was kind of enough for that one. <,<
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:30 PM
We are also talking about this in chat
Wes of StarArmy [SA]18-Apr-20 04:31 PM
I think Nashoba said it make him sick to read so maybe it was a bit graphic.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:32 PM
When describing a scene of violence, I build tense and portray the normal before I shatter it. I focus on the emotional impact of a scene with the sounds and smells.
The game rating system will help you set your players expectations.
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 04:34 PM
I'm a bad man and bringing up media examples like Bambi's Mom and the end of Grave of the Fireflies in voip. <,<; (edited)
In a month's time, the Motion Picture Association of America (MPAA) will be celebrating the 50th anniversary of their rating system, and so it seemed an opportune moment to take a dive into the data behind MPAA ratings. From 1968, a new voluntary code was established for movie...
Kylindra18-Apr-20 04:36 PM
because PG-13 is anything from Indiana Jones And The Temple of Doom..
.. to Suicide Squad..
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:36 PM
You have to really dig down into what those mean.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 04:37 PM
to the new Spiderman Movie.
Beautiful Night18-Apr-20 04:37 PM
The big issue that surrounds ratings systems is that they are largely culturally specific, and simming is a cross-cultural phenomenon
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:37 PM
A PG horror scene might be an action sequence and TERROR but gore will be light and implied simply.
RPG ratings seem more tailored to gaming and les region specific (MPAA isn't really international)
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 04:38 PM
I think effective gore is something different from just a splatter fest.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:39 PM
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 04:39 PM
Also, peoples imaginations are scarier than anything I can ever write. I just try to give them enough detail to fill in the gaps.
Stephen Hunter UK18-Apr-20 04:39 PM
The most effective gore is Al Gore.
Beautiful Night18-Apr-20 04:39 PM
plus there's the old addage about describing just enough for people to fill in the blanks with something way worse than you could ever write, than showing everylast slash of the knife
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:40 PM
Horror vs Terror: Terror is usually described as the feeling of dread and anticipation that precedes the horrifying experience. By contrast, horror is the feeling of revulsion that usually follows a frightening sight, sound, or otherwise experience.
Stephen Hunter UK18-Apr-20 04:40 PM
"Consistency of chunky salsa" worked just fine for Paranoia.
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 04:43 PM
There's a lot of talk in VOIP right now, but if you're after dread, I would take a page from Alfred Hitchcocks book of suspense. The classic example is letting the audience know there's a bomb under the table, the bomb is going to go off, and everyone in the room is the focus of the story. Let the tension build about when the bomb is going to go off.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:43 PM
So I think it is important to state that an effective scene is where you give your players hope. If you are trying to sell an impact, you need to provide moments of levity but you dash it away. Example, behind a mature wall: https://youtu.be/kdxtZ6UxYVo
Copyright Disclaimer Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringi...
You have to use your best judgement. Think about scary stuff you might see in "Are you Afraid of the Dark?" or "Goosebumps" vs "IT" or "The Shining"
The idea as a storyteller is balancing impact of scenes, and building suspense.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 04:47 PM
13 minutes until next panel.
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 04:48 PM
Guilty of the dutch angle myself in props.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:48 PM
You want to bring up small details to hint something is wrong. But to bring it back: Consent is key. Talk to your players and GM to determine what people are comfortable with. Utilizing some sort of rating system and understanding what you want out of your game will help you.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 04:49 PM
That's a double dutch angle
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 04:49 PM
It's extra extra discomforting.
Wes of StarArmy [SA]18-Apr-20 04:51 PM
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 04:51 PM
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 04:51 PM
I should be good. We have it going in Voice.
Thank you! I hope this wasn't too morbid. Next up is @Kirby [SU] on Critiquing and Reviewing. (edited)
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 04:54 PM
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 05:01 PM
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:01 PM
Hi, My name is Kirby, I am a member of Shattered Universe as well as the Creator, Producer, Video Editor, Janitor etc etc of Adult Commentary . I’ve been reviewing critiques and reviews of mostly videos, and several irl stage performances as well as some literature for a few years now.
Critiquing and Reviewing is one of these needed yet depending on the person, one of the most dreaded. Personally, I know I have been on either end of of the spectrum when I have been subject to a critique or review of something I have spent literal months working on just to have it examined by a group of peers to rate its worth. Somewhat on topic video filler
However, that is on the receiving end, and why I’m here today is to explain the giving end and how to properly execute and also give you some tips and tricks that I use when I both review and critique.
feel free to jump in and stuff as well, i got some prepared blocks of text but always ready for the random jump in
Firstly lets start with a definition
a critical appraisal of (a book, play, movie, etc.) for publication in a newspaper or magazine.
The key word to pick out here is appraisal, its a judgment.
Beautiful Night18-Apr-20 05:05 PM
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:06 PM
Beautiful Night18-Apr-20 05:06 PM
Why should we be engaging in critique and review in roleplaying? No one does this to be judged
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:06 PM
for the most of us most reviews may be for a piece of tech for your setting, a new character, maybe some weird new fauna for a planet thats inhabited by sentient rainbows. In this instance what you the reviewer will do will directly effect a player or a player base and that judgment may affect aforementioned things
Kylindra18-Apr-20 05:07 PM
(can I feel free to chime in?)
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:07 PM
go for it
Kylindra18-Apr-20 05:07 PM
So, there are several reasons you'll want to critique and review. One is you're adding to the setting, and want to make the feel of it match
Another is that you might be going "Does this idea make sense in my setting to pursue? Am I making Star Wars in Trek, or Trek inTrek? (As an example)"
and finally, you might want to improve your craft
this is all my opinion, anyway
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:08 PM
Indeed, for the most part this is focusing on the back end of the RP stuff, all the "rulebook" if you will section if you will
and with that being said
(going back to back to last block of text)
With this in mind, we as reviewers need to handle this potential bomb with care and not yeet it into a metaphorical garbage disposal of emotions and knee jerk reactions. So how do we do this?
Beautiful Night18-Apr-20 05:09 PM
ah, I assumed this was about the writing, not the back of house stuff
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:11 PM
In a way you can apply it to your stuff, knowing how back of house works you can use that knowledge to help your writings and submission stuff.
But all in all more back of house work is my focus\
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 05:11 PM
I try to approach a review for why people would enjoy reading or watching something.
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:11 PM
Kylindra18-Apr-20 05:12 PM
118 actually has us review writing and such occasionally
it's part of promotion requirements that you write at a certain level
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 05:12 PM
You need to come in with the mindset that "We're here to make this the best it can be", not so much a checklist that needs to be completed. IMO anyway. <,<
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:13 PM
So normally when I go into doing a review I have a handful of "rules" I like to follow
1: Treat every thing you review as if it comes from ::insert your favorite artist/writer/whatever here::
Yes I know im not going over Tarantino's new awesome script, but for the person who submitted it to me for review it may as well be for them. Yes I may talk with that person or rp with that person regularly and IMO I may think they are an ::expletive deleted:: and have stupid ideas, but I put on my professionalism hat, which leads us into the next section
2. Be professional
Pretty straight forward with this one, be professional when you’re reviewing stuff and treat everyone and everything with the respect that it entails, golden rule and all that. Do I have some eye rolling moments at stuff I’ve reviewd? Oh sweet powers that be yes, do I let that translate into my review? No, stay professional with it.
3. Be Specific
When reviewing and coming across an issue you want to point out be specific in what you are doing. For example lets say a you are going over a space ship concept and they have something wonktacular with the landing struts.
“I don’t like the struts” would be a poor example of what to bring up when finding said issue.
“Looking at the struts you have, I noticed that they work using XYZ, where as they should work via ZYX” would be better, you are addressing the issue and being specific on why you are addressing it.
4. Suggest, don’t tell.
Piggybacking off of the last one, don’t tell people what they should do to fix said issue, suggest and let them come to their own conclusions . Lets go with the strut example again
“make the strut flexible instead of a static one that will make it work” Does it fix the problem? Yes but now you are telling them how to make THEIR project, not your project work.
“I see you have it as a static strut, may I ask what your logic was behind that? I would suggest maybe switching it to a flexable one because of XYZ”
This one brings up the issue, asks them on their opinoin (which may lead to an eureka moment for you in your review) and also gives them a fix with reason that may give them a eureka moment as well. Win win and learning moments are awesome.
MaidenInsider18-Apr-20 05:16 PM
So let the trauma happen during the role playing?
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 05:18 PM
I think part of being specific is more about using precise language rather than tit for tatting suggestions with bad. Sometimes there are things that are beyond my ken and I can't provide an educated opinion. Perhaps I'm stupid, perhaps the wording needs to be revised for a more layman understanding.
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:19 PM
Wording is an issue some times yes,
Understandably we play internationally, so sometimes explaining things and how they work may not translate well
which is why when going at a review over someone's character for example, if you can try to get a one on one chat with them or at least have it in a place where you can have a conversation
One of the places I pull from from for this thing is my Directing background and dealing with actors and actresses in a stage setting.
For example I had an actee, who in a particular scene we ran though for the first time, decided to do a particular action I didn't quite understand, when asking them on why they chose that they didn't understand the given direction in the script (think it was a weird word for an emotion if i remember) which changed the whole scene
sitting down and explaining we had our Ah Ha moment and the show went on lol
Ikate Keda Studios18-Apr-20 05:27 PM
There was a ted talk or something where a soldier explained how when he was on post at some watch post cut off from the rest of the base, the thing he noticed most often was him and his squad mates were actually wanting to be attacked.
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 05:28 PM
Conversing directly will always be more effective than trying to communicate through text.
Ikate Keda Studios18-Apr-20 05:28 PM
Just a "God please someone shoot at us to end this boredom"
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:29 PM
Its all good im just default silence in chat lol
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 05:30 PM
I find things get interesting when you're dealing with large groups and people start skimming and missing details. But that's more the act of roleplaying instead of critiquing beforehand.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 05:30 PM
It;s important to remember that you are talking to a person vs a corporation or someone that may never see what you say
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:31 PM
Wes of StarArmy [SA]18-Apr-20 05:31 PM
"Remember the human"
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 05:31 PM
Well, the pursuit of excellence in a hobby shouldn't be discouraged. But there's a difference between improvement, and being cruel.
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:32 PM
so back to block of text
again we will start a definition
a detailed analysis and assessment of something, especially a literary, philosophical, or political theory.
Thanks Oxy, can I call you that? Too bad its a thing now Oxy.
For general purposes, Critiquing is the brain surgery to a general review. Where a review is akain to “He got hit in the face with a rock and that's how he died” and a critique is “Well because of the blunt force trauma caused by the solidified calcite, he suffered several cranial lacerations science science science medical terms medical terms medical terms.”
Generally, when critiquing you are going at a finished peace of work and you are dissecting it to show all its inner melty goodness and why it is why it is if that makes any sense. One key factor going into this, as opposed to a regular review, is normally done by a Subject matter expert (sme) or the like in said field. Down side to this is that, if doing a critique you may come off as poppus know it all type of person (again referencing the video beforehand) but this is something you as a critic have to take sometimes unfortunately.
but that being said, remember you are infact also a person so jumping back to one of the previous "rules" remember to treat things how you want to be treated, arbitrary to say sometimes but its one of the little things that we tend to slip up on and need to be reminded of
and appoligizes for the dead sections people reading, conversing in chat about things as well.
Either way, a nice sum up for things on critiquing is basically take the elements from reviewing and go at them with a scalpel, but also remember to remember that a scathing review or critique does not mean it is a good one
So, cool you got some nifty rules to follow or adapt to your own when doing stuff Awesome yay! Go you you suvived this dudes ramblings and ideas on the subject matter, but wait you want some insites and stuff of what I do? Well im honored you asked here some stuff I like to do when critiquing and reviewing stuff.
1. Get comfortable.
I can’t stress this enough, if youre stressed you’re review or critique will be stressed as well and thus make a mess of things. I like to schedule a rough time I like to do things, cause scheduling makes me happy.
Notes notes notes notes notes, and did I mention notes? I absolutely LOVE notes, most physical copies of things I’ve reviewd look like some crazy annotated version of the thing with highlights, interjections little blurbs of what happed or even just something simple as an LoL at a line. This is also great because if you divide your stuff up into different time, like you read the thing one day and got distracted (guilty) and and came back to it the next you have your own personal quips and memories to go off of.
3. Ask for help if you need it
No shame in doing this what so ever, maybe have someone else read over a bit you’re looking if your stuck or hey even be like “i was thinking about saying XYZ, does that sound right to you?” Simple stuff that you can do can go a looong way in the future, and also help keep your mind at ease (throwing back to tip one there, see what I did?)
4. Have fun or at least make it enjoyable
Most important tip from me is to have fun with it. Yes it may be monotonous or mind numbing at times (or melting for example if you’ve ever seen or read the My Immortal Harry Potter fan fic and decided to review it like an idiot (me) ) but there's no reason you can’t turn it into something fun. For example I like to do my Commentary Reviews/critiques on the weekends when im off work, which also happen to be my cheat days for my diet, so its like watching a movie and enjoying some snacks for me even though what I may be going over may just be the largest pile of hot garbage next to the atari et video game dumpsite.
Anyway that about covers all I have, if you have any questions of me feel free to ask! Or comments or anything else for the time we have remaining thanks for coming to my SciWorld ‘20 talk ::plays round of applause and sweet outro music::
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 05:44 PM
15 minutes. Let us know if you need to user overflow.
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:45 PM
We should be good
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 05:57 PM
Next panel is @Jack Pine Worldbuilding: Tech and Culture
Kirby [SU]18-Apr-20 05:58 PM
Thanks again everyone!
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:02 PM
Hi, and welcome to my panel this year. Some of you may remember me from the last two years, and the panels I ran then. But to intro to those who are new this year, I'm Jack Pine. I'm a player in a TNU, and I'm staff as well as a faction manager in Star Army Roleplay going on three years. I've been a GM for just as long, and hope that I can provide something useful for you all out of those experiences.
@Ames is my right hand man, one of my GMs, and one of my Co-FMs. He'll be helping me today in this panel.
Ames18-Apr-20 06:05 PM
Hello, everyone! I'll be helping Jack. I'm Whisper. I've been RPing online since '98 and on tabletop since '06. My love of gaming led me to work at Riot Games for ~8 years, where I worked on a lot of technical projects and also helped to create the Champion Relaunch team. I've been on Star Army for a little while now and recently joined Jack as a Co-FM. :)
I love worldbuilding, so I'm really excited to be here! Looking forward to your questions. (edited)
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:06 PM
so where should we start I wonder, as this is a pretty large topic to discuss, and a lot of faucets of it to cover potentially.
Wes of StarArmy [SA]18-Apr-20 06:06 PM
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:06 PM
I guess we can discuss our recent work and work off that whisper for the discussion?
RaWolfe18-Apr-20 06:06 PM
Heh didnt know that on Riot fact @Ames I learn every day something new
Ames18-Apr-20 06:07 PM
It's not something I make a big deal about. :)
That sounds good, Jack! I have a few topics we can get into later, too
Kylindra18-Apr-20 06:08 PM
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:09 PM
Well to start off on that note then, as we've mentioned, both me and Whisp are faction managers. We've been slowly building an in character nation from the ground up, and trying to make heads or tails of who they should be as a group. I think it all started with how they began, but to give the short versions. They starting out just trying to help and improve where they began, but learned things, and made mistakes along the way.
This is important, because any group you're going to make, is highly shaped off their goals and where they started. As both confer different needs, and different wants as a people.
RaWolfe18-Apr-20 06:10 PM
Kinda the "Every action has its own unique reaction" deal, which is the best approach to my taste
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:12 PM
yes, and instead of just plopping down a entirely made from start group, it was shown better as doing so through story telling and development of the characters who started it.
Worldbuilding kinda starts with how what is already there, interacts with the seed of the new elements being developed.
Ames18-Apr-20 06:13 PM
One of the things that always stuck with me is when I tried to draw a map for a fantasy setting. Rivers are surprisingly complicated! Where does the water come from? Why does the river split? Where does the water go? Who settles along it, where, and why? What did it do to the rocks, forests, etc in that area?
A simple squiggly blue line on a map has a ton of questions to be answered. I think that same approach is true when working on a culture. You have an initial thread, but where does it go?
What decisions do you make along the way, and what ripples come off of that?
RaWolfe18-Apr-20 06:14 PM
It is, when i created Exonia I had to make a map, players wanted to know what they were in for. That is very detailing work without even realizing it and makes you appreciate the art a bit more
Rockyeahh [TNU]18-Apr-20 06:15 PM
A friend of mine has spent years developing his own game. It's his hobby and he loves drawing maps down to the smallest detail but he still points out that it's incredibly complicated because of how the land affects what lives there and how they live there.
RaWolfe18-Apr-20 06:16 PM
A start and end is easy, but the steps you take beyond that is the greatest challenge on its own.
Ames18-Apr-20 06:17 PM
Exactly! And then you have to think: What if someone goes to one of these little marks on the map? Players always break your expectations.
The same is true for culture. If you set up good broad strokes, then people can extrapolate from there in ways that stay aligned with the culture you've established
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 06:17 PM
People tend to ignore how important water is to the early development of society. China was a hydrologic society where the rise and fall of dynasties were focused around droughts.
Kylindra18-Apr-20 06:17 PM
I try to go from large view "This kingdom needs to focus something like this." and work out how that might have happened
It never really works out that way, but it makes a good start point to draw a map
Noodlewerfer18-Apr-20 06:17 PM
Oh yeah, groups that just show up out of nowhere with no development can be... problematic...
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:18 PM
Hence why my first attempt was from a hand full of characters, who took three years in RP to get where they are now.
I think it was probably the best developmental choice I ever made, and it's been the most rewarding compared to a easy bake option.
Ames18-Apr-20 06:19 PM
I get to take advantage of all of your hardwork. Win-win for me.
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:19 PM
now when I say three years in RP, I mean three actual years of writing the story of this rise out.
Ames18-Apr-20 06:22 PM
So one thing that I think is worth talking about is how we make different culture and technology groups distinct. That sound like an alright thread to follow, Jack?
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:22 PM
I was actually planning to lead into that, so that's perfect
but I wanted to touch on government just before that
Ames18-Apr-20 06:22 PM
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:22 PM
as most develop around the rise of civilizations in any form.
When creating their eventual government, I didn't plan to make the best government, or a utopia, but just one that could handle all the trials they had faced along the way. And be able to not make the same mistakes as their old place of settlement.
This not only has a huge influence on the characters, but nods to the history they've developed along the way.
Want to understand why Putin does what he does? Look at a map.
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:25 PM
It means people have something to actually remember as to why how things have become the way they are currently, why they seek to build things up the way they do. Now I want to make this clear that this built and developed view is still not always going to be perfect, and thus does not mean their idea of government will be perfect either.
there's room for growth pains, and adjustments as they face new trials, so development tends to be loosely planned ideally.
They may have built a government to handle issues they have dealt with efficiently, new ones could prove them surprisingly lacking in dealing with.
Maslow's hierarchy of needs is a motivational theory in psychology comprising a five-tier model of human needs, often depicted as hierarchical levels within a pyramid. When one need is fulfilled a person seeks to fulifil the next one, and so on. Every person is capable and has...
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:28 PM
(forgive my pauses, wrist gets sore from lots of typing sometimes)
RaWolfe18-Apr-20 06:28 PM
Maslow is a good example, it can be used in various forms. From the original human needs to the setting of how a government could proper function. So excellent choice there Kim
It’s one of the great cliche responses to science fiction. “Earth has dozens of different biomes, but every planet in sci fi is just one thing, either it’s all desert or all froze…
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:30 PM
that's one thing I've tried to avoid is one biome worlds, as variety of terrain proved diverse obstacles. This also means different forms of life, and how those little living details interact with these obstacles as well.
This is one reason why tech of this nation, tends to be unorthodox as they are made with these numerous terrains in mine, and thus have to adjust function around this.
This goes from clothing and food, to even weapons and vehicles.
Mecha meme18-Apr-20 06:32 PM
Quick question, not to seem attacking, but is this panel about worldbuilding tech and cultures in general, or about doing so for your faction?
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:32 PM
We're using it as an example, and have not even mentioned the name of the faction used as an example.
Rockyeahh [TNU]18-Apr-20 06:35 PM
I would recommend www.game-cities.com It's run by Konstantinos Dimopoulos. I read his articles in a magazine called Wireframe. He covers desiginkng fictional cities, how it creates cultures and so on. It's brilliant stuff.
(I also think this panel is awesome). (edited)
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:36 PM
@Ames think this might be a good point to hop to culture, unless you think I missed something on the topic of government?
Ames18-Apr-20 06:37 PM
I think it's worth jumping to, since a lot of government derives from culture. Good segue.
We've mentioned it in the voice chat, but culture derives a lot from geography and population. That seems like a straight-forward comment, but it's worth considering. Where are your people located? What needs do they have to work for and what needs are easily solved? Who are your population? What do they care about?
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:39 PM
The more diverse a populations, the more issues that can arise from trying to get them to mesh and cooperate.
Ames18-Apr-20 06:40 PM
Geography has a lot of influence, obviously - if you life in a forest, you have plenty of wood, so you're likely going to have a culture based in part around that. How long it takes the trees to go back is also an important element. If trees grow back extremely quickly (or you can move to get more), then your culture might not appreciate trees as anything but a resource. If they take a long time, then the culture might try to treat them with respect and as a limited commodity. Think WoW Orcs vs D&D/Tolkien Elves (edited)
RaWolfe18-Apr-20 06:41 PM
More different species, more issues, or better say more needs to make a group happy. But there should be a line that makes you as a gov stand your ground and make choices that wont make everyone happy. Did your group reach that line?
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:41 PM
we are actually at that point currently, and it's an interesting challenge we're trying to solve.
we're also looking at what flaws this brings about in the culture and the government, in how their lack of experience in dealing with it, might cause further issues. Or even how it forces them to change, or react to the situation.
Ames18-Apr-20 06:43 PM
Similarly, your population and its needs are a big factor. My current efforts have been around 'What does a nation made of clones do?' If everyone is born as adults, fully formed, do they have the same concepts of self, of family, and so forth. Star Army has a few examples of this, so finding a way to do it that the other factions haven't already done is a challenge!
So, what factors influence your people's wants and needs? How long do they live? Who do they interact with? What is their 'in' group and what is their 'other'? (edited)
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:43 PM
Will it create divides, or force a sort of reformation at a certain level? Has been a major question so far, and how do these species view and interact with each other. (edited)
RaWolfe18-Apr-20 06:44 PM
Its like a mass effect choice dialogue...you never fully know what will come next. Which makes it fun. Another question, culture diversity is also something that is impact by their surroundings. Say...a species homeworld is drastically changed and news hit your government, this might take a spin or toll on your gov. Is your faction build to deal with such events?
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 06:45 PM
This panel ends in 15 minutes. We can continue the discussion in overflow 1
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:46 PM
Another important factor which is interesting, is this nation's home actually already has inhabitants. We were talking about the US where the settlers interacted with the natives. This is currently something they are figuring out right now as well.
so not only do they have internal social issues to deal with, but also outside ones as well.
Ames18-Apr-20 06:47 PM
If we've got fifteen minutes left, maybe we could do some short form Q&A in chat?
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:47 PM
Sure, I think it would be good, so everyone can have any of our points so far, clarified upon if needed. (edited)
Ames18-Apr-20 06:48 PM
So, I can start us off - @Jack Pine ! What are your thoughts about using tropes in worldbuilding?
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:48 PM
Noodlewerfer18-Apr-20 06:48 PM
Adopt all the inhabitants
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:48 PM
Ames18-Apr-20 06:49 PM
"Elves are tall, thin, and great archers" would be an example. It's sort of like stereotyping, but for everything
The definition is something like.. "a common or overused theme or device" (Merriam-Webster)
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:50 PM
Depends on how deep they're used, as that might be partially true on an overall species view. It will not necessarily be right from person to person of the species a majority of the time.
This really shows in character interactions, but not mass social movements.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 06:50 PM
10 minutes; going to need an overflow?
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:51 PM
We might, depends on if anyone has questions still, or wants to continue the discussion.
Ames18-Apr-20 06:51 PM
Here's another question: what do you think about key technologies that define a culture?
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:52 PM
I think they're important, but shouldn't be overused. But I also feel that naturally there would be very few that manage to reach that point.
But when they do, they can be very impactful
Noodlewerfer18-Apr-20 06:53 PM
It'd probably be good to think about the average citizens' abilities too
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:54 PM
Generally those kind of tech are usually made to improve them to a sort of standard, or in the case of the movie equilibrium, lower them to an equal standard.
Noodlewerfer18-Apr-20 06:54 PM
For Butterdemons, since they can fly and climb walls they can have upside down furniture and doors with a vertical drop on the other side in their homes
Ames18-Apr-20 06:54 PM
I have no idea what a Butterdemon is, but that's a great example
Noodlewerfer18-Apr-20 06:54 PM
Unfortunately there's only a couple settings they're still in
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:55 PM
look at Adria and Adi on SARP whisp (edited)
they were just one offs there though
Noodlewerfer18-Apr-20 06:55 PM
Adria and Adi's SARP counterparts are kind of nerfed versions
Ames18-Apr-20 06:55 PM
Noodlewerfer18-Apr-20 06:55 PM
When they're real butterdemons they have extreme heat resistance, more vulnerability to cold, and fire magic
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:56 PM
Noodlewerfer18-Apr-20 06:56 PM
they have that technically but they're just cat teeth in SARP
also they drink blood outside of SARP
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 06:57 PM
3 minute warning. Going to need to move to #overflow-1 ?
Jack Pine18-Apr-20 06:57 PM
@Ames continue in overflow ya think?
Ames18-Apr-20 06:57 PM
I've gotta step away at 7, BUT if anyone wants to talk to me about any of this stuff, I love worldbuilding and would be happy to talk more via DMs or something
Wes of StarArmy [SA]18-Apr-20 06:57 PM
Thanks for hosting this panel Jack Pine!
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 06:58 PM
Next panel is Romance in Roleplaying with me. Again
It's the expectation of affection without asking for it, and while angsting over the friendzone legitmately can be a thing, angsting without acting on it or resolving the tension in the relationship can become very unhealthy.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:13 PM
It is possible for people that are attracted to one another to be friends without crossing the threshold of relationship because they never expressed that desire.
Talking honestly about your wants and desires will get you farther than stalking them and agreeing to whatever they want to just spend time with them. That is unhealthy
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 07:14 PM
I think a big part of it is that people worry that if their romantic proposal is rejected, they'll lose what they have.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:14 PM
Friendships are not about the possibility of having sex with them.
But sex and love are not mutually exclusive either.
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 07:15 PM
Well, that's also part of it. Would you still be friends with them without the possibility of sex?
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:15 PM
If the answer is no, you are a bit of a bad person.
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 07:15 PM
Well, maybe that character is a bad person.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:16 PM
People are not objects for your amusement. But framing your desires is important.
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 07:16 PM
Wait, are we having a Lonely Hearts panel, or a romance in fiction panel? ,<
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:16 PM
Maybe both. I started with Friendzone first since I see it the most
Feel free to interject or comment
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 07:17 PM
Kylindra18-Apr-20 07:17 PM
Speaking about this.. I find that in roleplays, the first step is making sure the other player is at all interested in their PC having one. Some.. really aren't, or haven't gotten burnt before.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:18 PM
Once you establish that the characters are interested in one another and have communicated, it is important to have an OOC conversation on what you are willing to play.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 07:19 PM
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:19 PM
If someone is underage, ERP will never happen. If the person hates ERP, it will never happen.
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 07:19 PM
Well, I think part of the friendzone is being able to accept that you can resolve the tension and find a new normal. Regardless of romance initiating or otherwise.
Maybe you really do just remain friends.
It could be the case that romance is impossible because of circumstances, or personal reasons such as not dating within a sharehouse. Even though you get along really well and maybe if things had been different it could have happened, but you do have to find a way to live next to each other...however often you see them.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:23 PM
It is possible to have non-physical romantic relationships but you should communicate with the person what it is that makes you happy. But no one should sacrifice their desires in the wake of someone else.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 07:24 PM
True there also can be some kind of connection with platonic relationships but they are not like full on romantic; different topic but kind of related... Relationships are complicated.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:24 PM
Romantic feelings are incredibly nuanced. There should be no pressure on friends to sleep together.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 07:24 PM
sex /= equal connection
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:25 PM
But if you are friends that have a sexual relationship that's a valid relationship too. It doesn't have to have romantic feelings attached.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 07:26 PM
and open relationships with romantic partnerships are a thing
Jimmy [SU+WSO]18-Apr-20 07:26 PM
Well, I think there's a difference between a caring relationship and a romantic one. Because you can help someone recover from their seizures and pick themselves back up, and also remind them that they had one so they can tell their doctor, and have really deep conversations, and nothing really sparks between you like that.
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:27 PM
It is also important to consider if you believe in the validity in polyamory vs monogamy or if you only believe in true love.
True; really makes sense. YOu can have multiple partners with "true" love but its all based on beliefs and values... so again its OOC values that mix in.
Good question though; starting a relationship where both characters have interest and both players are up for it
but like not knowing how ot begin
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:31 PM
In voice of course, we are talking about active bystanders, alcohol and consent. .
In roleplay, important decisions on relationships should probably be made sober but things happen. I think roleplaying active consent is a healthy practice.
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 07:34 PM
But how would you move into a romantic situation when both characters feel they are in that space though the players dont know how to do it; conversation is important but like... sometimes its rough to start if you don't know what you want... if that makes sense?
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:35 PM
Asking can be a bit awkward but someone should make that jump. I have red faced and awkwardly asked someone out on a date.
"...I... like.. you!!"
"Can I Kiss you?"
"I find you really attractive. I want to have sex with you."
You should probably be honest about what you want if you want something. (edited)
Josh [TNU]18-Apr-20 07:40 PM
[OPP | SU | TNU] Kim18-Apr-20 07:40 PM
There should never be any pressure for a relationship to happen.
If you are not okay with something out of character, you shouldn't push forward. If you are uncomfortable you should be honest.
"Now, you are going to drink a little from me," Misha's voice rumbled as he settled his right arm around me. Pulling me from my thoughts. "You can take it from here," he tapped my neck with his fingers before trailing down to my wrist. "Or here. Or if you are feeling adventurous…" His hand roamed down the front of my body and settled between my thighs. "It's easiest to drink at pressure points. If you don't remember them all from your army training, anywhere the body bends." He kept his hand between my legs as I shifted uncomfortably.
"M… Misha, we just… I mean, I just… Why am I drinking your blood?" I stammered. A little voice at the back of my mind growled and urged me to bite his muscular neck. I shifted to get closer to him.
"It brings us together," he patiently replied. I lifted my face to his neck, my mouth watered as I placed my mouth against his skin. Sharp fangs slid into place as I bit down.
Cool blood poured into my mouth, coating my tongue like a rich, velvety wine. My muddled thoughts quieted as electricity sparked through my veins. A husky voice purred in the back of my mind, "Take all of him in. He's right there. Can't you hear him? Can't you… feel him?"
I think it can be fun and interesting if your other player is onboard.